Sia vs. Storj vs. MaidSAFE
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Can you point me to some documentation on [paid downloads]. Very curious.
Currently, there's not much documentation on how it works. When you create a file contract with a host, you also create a payment channel to the host. You can then use that payment channel to pay for downloads. More will be explained in our upcoming whitepaper rewrite.
Homogeneous solutions lead to Sybil attack vectors.
??? Can you explain that more, I do not think it is correct.
Quick question: For Sia does the person storing data and/or the person farming need to run a blockchain node?
If you want the full security and decentralization benefits, you need to run a full node. If you are a host, you need to run a full node. If you are a renter, you need to run a full node. You could do SPV, but then you are not getting full security.
So the renter would have to be online to do that check? Is the money refunded to the renter in that case?
Tell me a little bit more about the 10 minute checks. For example if the farmer goes offline for 30 minutes, who checks this and what penalties are imposed.
The renter would need to be online to do the check, yes. If the renter is not online though, they already will not know when a host is offline. If a host is online every time that the renter is online, then from the perspective of the renter the host is perfectly acceptable.
Refunding money to the renter is actually a dangerous position for hosts to be in. If I create a $5000 file contract, and I know that I can get the money refunded by knocking the host offline, then I've got a strong incentive to DDOS the host and make sure that the host is unable to submit the storage proof, and make sure that the host is unable to provide proofs to the blockchain. It's bad incentive alignment. The default settings of Sia do not have the renter getting refunded under any circumstances, because of this incentive mis-alignment. The host can only receive penalties (in the default configuration - the protocol supports renter refunds but I think that it's a dangerous thing for a host to agree to, especially for long term file contracts or for high value / large file contracts).
If a host is offline when the renter tries to perform an uptime check, the host is penalized in the renter's database. The renter will be less likely to select that host again, because the renter has strict requirements about uptime. The host can still get paid for the file contract if they come back online, but they will be losing a lot of potential future revenue because nobody will trust them.
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If it became apparent that hosts were doing abusive witholding attacks (accepting storage contracts, then going offline until a storage proof was needed), we could extend the protocol to support 'surprise' storage proofs that would need to go on-chain. But this adds complexity, and I really don't forsee it being an issue. The selection penalties that hosts face for going offline are already severe, it should be severe enough to prevent this kind of behavior in the host. It's not profitable.
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@Taek "As far as I'm aware, a global decentralized reputation system is not possible, or at least modern science doesn't understand how to do it."
I believe morphis uses a decentralized reputation system. Or atleast i know it was/is being implemented for the decentralized discussion system once its done. You should check out its code
Sidenote, its surprising that this doesn't this forum force https when registering.
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Sia's sia note and siacon design is much better than Storj.
Let's see which storage will be faster, more stable.
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@Taek "As far as I'm aware, a global decentralized reputation system is not possible, or at least modern science doesn't understand how to do it."
I thought about it a lot more, and I now have some good ideas for places to get started. It's not a problem we intend to solve in the next year, but maybe in the next two we'll be able to put in something that resembles a reliable decentralized automated reputation system.
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"but the goals, design, and approaches of IPFS make it a significantly different "
how, in what ways?
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@sonicman said in Sia vs. Storj vs. MaidSAFE:
"but the goals, design, and approaches of IPFS make it a significantly different "
how, in what ways?
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Hi Taek,
Nice product and thanks for the comparison.
In this news, Storj is going for Ethereum:
http://www.coindesk.com/storj-migrate-decentralized-storage-service-ethereum-blockchain/Seems that brings 2 advantages to them:
- make up the lack of smart contract for Storj
- ether is widely used and many businesses may build on Ethereum
I have Ether and Siacoin, and am familiar with the system. But for most of people, using Siacoin to pay and get-paid may be a bit of inconvenient.
Do you have any thought about this?
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Yeah, I just saw that too on Storj's recent blog post:
Three weeks ago we [Storj] announced our migration from Counterparty to the Ethereum platform. When we first considered making the move, we were primarily concerned with providing an improved user experience via access to better wallets and tools.
- Storj: New Protocol, New Opportunities (Apr 14th, 2017)
http://blog.storj.io/post/159566947133/storj-new-protocol-new-opportunities
It would be nice to have more wallet options for Sia, especially mobile wallets. But this looks like it could be a ways down the road.
What stood out to me more though was this section of the same blog:
Dead Simple File Storage - Hundreds of people have requested this, and we’re excited to make this dream come true. For the past several months we’ve been working with a partner with a massive install base to create a graphical user interface for Storj. We expect to announce this partnership very soon.
So far only Sia has a GUI for clients. I'll be interested to see how the Storj GUI looks and performs. Still think I'll like Sia best.
- Storj: New Protocol, New Opportunities (Apr 14th, 2017)
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So far only Sia has a GUI for clients. I'll be interested to see how the Storj GUI looks and performs. Still think I'll like Sia best.
Knowing them, it'll probably have pretty good design. But, I think really important to distinguish (at least at this point) that Storj is not a decentralized or trustless platform. If the Storj company were to disappear, hosts would stop getting paid, and most users would be unable to recover their files. The fact that Storj is a required middleman for any of the payouts to work should be a huge red flag.
It would be nice to have more wallet options for Sia, especially mobile wallets. But this looks like it could be a ways down the road.
We are more focused on getting the core platform running better. Mainly, we want to see
- ability to delete local files after uploading
- ability to restore files from a backup you made months ago
- ability to share files between Sia users
After we have those things, we'll take a step back and decide what the next moves are.
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Storj is not a decentralized or trustless platform.
Yeah, I noticed that too and didn't like that about Storj.
We are more focused on getting the core platform running better.
Yes, the points you listed are far more urgent. Wallets can wait :)
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Also check this link: https://coinjoker.com/sia-storj-maidsafe-comparing-distributed-decentralized-storage-options/
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...not to forget the newest kid on the block, FileCoin and it's massie ICO:
https://www.coindesk.com/257-million-filecoin-breaks-time-record-ico-funding/
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I would very much like to hear your latest news about this topic
