First revenue reported.



  • I'm a newbie on SIA but looking at your numbers and statistics they make some senses, you earn a little bet less than 5 SC/day for your <300MB storage used and it shows in your storage revenue. 300MB used out of 5.5GB is almost 6% which is pretty good considering that the platform average is 2% and your prices are way above the 100SC price average. What you seem to ignore are the fees, they are above the revenues this could explain your balance going down. I haven't figured out how the fees are calculated, as I said I'm a newbie, but it looks like so far they are not to your advantage. I also noticed that your collateral are way above any kind of income you can expect, are you backing your platform to an offsite solution? in case of flood, fire,disk crash, robbery or others disasters, otherwise you might very easily lose your collateral. With your figures I don't have a clue to what happened to the the 19KSC discrepancy.



  • @lexmark
    I believe it is really a sort of bugs affecting the numbers shown by the siac host -v.
    So the numbers that seem to me at least "likely credible" are:

    • the number of active contracts (after restart of siad)
    • storage folder usage

    And these correlate well to the used storage:

    • storage and upload/download revenue (earned and potential)
    • risked collateral.

    Completely unbelievable seems the reported locked collateral. That simply can't be true if the balance reported by wallet is accurate. One of these numbers is incorrect, I just hope that the incorrect one is the reported locked collateral and not the balance reported by wallet module.
    And I know the transaction list does not show all transactions. Earned revenues are in invisible transactions. That is definitely a bug.
    As a host I don't pay any fees. Only transaction fees for submitting storage proofs and contracts to the blockchain. But these are so low that I don't take them into account.

    If you ask why do I do this like I do, that need a bit longer explanation.
    The short version (main reason) is- I am testing. I want to prove my belief that you don't need to be cheaper than others to earn some money. Or, if not, i'll know I was wrong...

    Yes, I am aware I risk real money. I know I would loose in case of a disaster.
    But I am to old to believe there is an easy profit possible without taking risk. So I have done most of possible to limit the risk. In case of flood or fire the lost collateral would be one of the least losses. I trust the hardware my host runs on. And that is not cheap. Of course, there are more things possible to do but that would be to expensive, I have not the funding to build a real datacenter with independent separate power and internet connections.



  • Oh, I think I got the reason for the reported locked collateral...
    If I look at the current numbers:
    Locked Collateral: 43.02 KS
    and that I have 5TB shared.
    There are some contracts still active from time I had set the collateral higher.
    I started with 1000SC as storage price and 3000SC as collateral for 1TB/month if I remember right.
    So my numbers won't be exact but at least should point the direction.

    I'll assume 45KS locked for 5TB data (44.4KS seen as reported). That means 9KS for 1TB.
    If divided by 1500SC/TB/month I get the result my 5TB are already reserved for 6 months.
    But as the default contract duration is 3 months (or it is expected to renew after 3 months), only half of the collateral is being locked for real.
    Hmm.
    That would make sense. And it makes my theory about "I am completely booked (logically locked) out" more likely to be true. That would mean "I will not get new contracts until previous expire" regardless what pricing for my services I set...
    So, that would also mean if I do not change the collateral per TB and do not increase the shared space (don't add more shared folders), It should not grow bigger than 45KS.
    The easiest way to test that would be by adding more space.
    So, if I add 1 TB more storage, the reported "Locked collateral" should rise by 9KS after a while and reach nearly 54KS.
    And the balance in wallet should drop by ~4.5KS and reach something around 49KS (as I expect some revenue from old contracts).

    I'll continue to gradually lower the storage price. Next stop is at 450 (have 495 at present). After that I'll "tweak" my collateral settings.

    If i look at my host usage graph for the 3m period, I clearly recognize there is a correlation between available (shared space) and used space. Every time I add more storage, there is a used storage step up too.



  • Added 2TB.
    A snapshot for the history:

    siac host -v
    General Info:
            Connectability Status: Host appears to be working.
    
    Host Internal Settings:
            acceptingcontracts:   Yes
            maxduration:          53 Weeks
            maxdownloadbatchsize: 83.89 MB
            maxrevisebatchsize:   83.89 MB
            netaddress:           sia.eters.lv:9982 (manually specified)
            windowsize:           24 Hours
    
            collateral:       1.5 KS / TB / Month
            collateralbudget: 75 KS
            maxcollateral:    15 KS Per Contract
    
            mincontractprice:          2.5 SC
            mindownloadbandwidthprice: 0 H / TB
            minstorageprice:           495 SC / TB / Month
            minuploadbandwidthprice:   50 SC / TB
    
    Host Financials:
            Contract Count:               112
            Transaction Fee Compensation: 122.5 SC
            Potential Fee Compensation:   535 SC
            Transaction Fee Expenses:     0 H
    
            Storage Revenue:           99.62 SC
            Potential Storage Revenue: 484.1 SC
    
            Locked Collateral: 43.02 KS
            Risked Collateral: 1.27 KS
            Lost Collateral:   0 H
    
            Download Revenue:           3.951 mS
            Potential Download Revenue: 18.68 mS
            Upload Revenue:             3.444 SC
            Potential Upload Revenue:   14.1 SC
    
    RPC Stats:
            Error Calls:        65
            Unrecognized Calls: 1
            Download Calls:     870
            Renew Calls:        9
            Revise Calls:       271
            Settings Calls:     32907
            FormContract Calls: 23
    
    Storage Folders:
        Used         Capacity      % Used    Path
        15.833 GB    249.913 GB    6.34      /storage1/siashared0
        21.466 GB    249.913 GB    8.59      /storage1/siashared1
        13.988 GB    249.913 GB    5.60      /storage1/siashared10
        14.235 GB    249.913 GB    5.70      /storage1/siashared11
        14.579 GB    249.913 GB    5.83      /storage1/siashared12
        14.470 GB    249.913 GB    5.79      /storage1/siashared13
        14.361 GB    249.913 GB    5.75      /storage1/siashared14
        14.827 GB    249.913 GB    5.93      /storage1/siashared15
        14.244 GB    249.913 GB    5.70      /storage1/siashared16
        5.348 GB     249.913 GB    2.14      /storage1/siashared17
        1.309 GB     249.913 GB    0.52      /storage1/siashared18
        1.460 GB     249.913 GB    0.58      /storage1/siashared19
        20.628 GB    249.913 GB    8.25      /storage1/siashared2
        0 B          249.913 GB    0.00      /storage1/siashared20
        0 B          249.913 GB    0.00      /storage1/siashared21
        0 B          249.913 GB    0.00      /storage1/siashared22
        0 B          249.913 GB    0.00      /storage1/siashared23
        0 B          249.913 GB    0.00      /storage1/siashared24
        0 B          249.913 GB    0.00      /storage1/siashared25
        0 B          249.913 GB    0.00      /storage1/siashared26
        0 B          249.913 GB    0.00      /storage1/siashared27
        18.161 GB    249.913 GB    7.27      /storage1/siashared3
        18.187 GB    249.913 GB    7.28      /storage1/siashared4
        17.486 GB    249.913 GB    7.00      /storage1/siashared5
        17.532 GB    249.913 GB    7.02      /storage1/siashared6
        17.989 GB    249.913 GB    7.20      /storage1/siashared7
        17.713 GB    249.913 GB    7.09      /storage1/siashared8
        15.863 GB    249.913 GB    6.35      /storage1/siashared9
    

    And

    siac wallet balance
    Wallet status:
    Encrypted, Unlocked
    Confirmed Balance:   52.71 KS
    Unconfirmed Delta:  +0 H
    Exact:               52712511327820875117829893426 H
    Siafunds:            0 SF
    Siafund Claims:      0 H
    
    Estimated Fee:       30 mS / KB
    

    So I expect the "Locked collateral" rise to something like 61KS
    and
    Confirmed balance to drop to near 44KS

    Lets wait...



  • @reinisp Yes the fees are small but so are the revenues, the fees are higher than the revenue about 120% fee, I don't understand how you can expect to make a profit out of this system. At the current rate and without the fees you earn just enough to pay for 10W of electricity I guess your system used a lot more than that.



  • @lexmark
    It is just... you can't make profit with hosting at present.
    Just look at any top 100 hosts. No one is earning more than 10SC a day. No matter how many contracts, available or used storage they have. The main hope for all hosts is the growing demand from renters.
    So it is a good time to test things out and prepare for the time people realize that storage on Sia is better than storage at Amazon, Microsoft or Google or whatever "conventional cloud storage".
    One of things to test and try is to minimize the operating costs. The "least loss" currently could be the siaberry project. But you can't really expect any profit even with that. 8TB drives are the best in $/Tb terms, but they still cost more than you can earn with current pricing in 2 years. And remember, a hosts shared storage won't ever be fully utilized (the remaining storage penalty).
    This is one of reasons I am not going to lower my price to such a low level as it is common at present. I am already earning the same amount of SC from my 280 GB used by renters as others get from a terabyte used.



  • Two weeks passed, time to take a snapshot.

    Host Internal Settings:
            acceptingcontracts:   Yes
            maxduration:          53 Weeks
            maxdownloadbatchsize: 83.89 MB
            maxrevisebatchsize:   83.89 MB
            netaddress:           sia.eters.lv:9982 (manually specified)
            windowsize:           24 Hours
    
            collateral:       1.5 KS / TB / Month
            collateralbudget: 75 KS
            maxcollateral:    15 KS Per Contract
    
            mincontractprice:          2.5 SC
            mindownloadbandwidthprice: 0 H / TB
            minstorageprice:           445 SC / TB / Month
            minuploadbandwidthprice:   50 SC / TB
    
    Host Financials:
            Contract Count:               140
            Transaction Fee Compensation: 190 SC
            Potential Fee Compensation:   587.5 SC
            Transaction Fee Expenses:     0 H
    
            Storage Revenue:           135.6 SC
            Potential Storage Revenue: 862.9 SC
    
            Locked Collateral: 45.57 KS
            Risked Collateral: 2.559 KS
            Lost Collateral:   0 H
    
            Download Revenue:           20.61 mS
            Potential Download Revenue: 2.017 mS
            Upload Revenue:             4.839 SC
            Potential Upload Revenue:   15.1 SC
    
    RPC Stats:
            Error Calls:        110
            Unrecognized Calls: 23
            Download Calls:     3321
            Renew Calls:        24
            Revise Calls:       4729
            Settings Calls:     68460
            FormContract Calls: 5
    
    Storage Folders:
        Used         Capacity      % Used    Path
        16.161 GB    249.913 GB    6.47      /storage1/siashared0
        21.877 GB    249.913 GB    8.75      /storage1/siashared1
        15.724 GB    249.913 GB    6.29      /storage1/siashared10
        15.984 GB    249.913 GB    6.40      /storage1/siashared11
        16.110 GB    249.913 GB    6.45      /storage1/siashared12
        16.085 GB    249.913 GB    6.44      /storage1/siashared13
        16.022 GB    249.913 GB    6.41      /storage1/siashared14
        16.333 GB    249.913 GB    6.54      /storage1/siashared15
        15.993 GB    249.913 GB    6.40      /storage1/siashared16
        7.009 GB     249.913 GB    2.80      /storage1/siashared17
        2.957 GB     249.913 GB    1.18      /storage1/siashared18
        3.154 GB     249.913 GB    1.26      /storage1/siashared19
        20.841 GB    249.913 GB    8.34      /storage1/siashared2
        1.728 GB     249.913 GB    0.69      /storage1/siashared20
        1.627 GB     249.913 GB    0.65      /storage1/siashared21
        1.816 GB     249.913 GB    0.73      /storage1/siashared22
        1.825 GB     249.913 GB    0.73      /storage1/siashared23
        1.585 GB     249.913 GB    0.63      /storage1/siashared24
        1.732 GB     249.913 GB    0.69      /storage1/siashared25
        1.552 GB     249.913 GB    0.62      /storage1/siashared26
        1.741 GB     249.913 GB    0.70      /storage1/siashared27
        18.388 GB    249.913 GB    7.36      /storage1/siashared3
        18.488 GB    249.913 GB    7.40      /storage1/siashared4
        17.734 GB    249.913 GB    7.10      /storage1/siashared5
        17.998 GB    249.913 GB    7.20      /storage1/siashared6
        18.317 GB    249.913 GB    7.33      /storage1/siashared7
        17.834 GB    249.913 GB    7.14      /storage1/siashared8
        16.035 GB    249.913 GB    6.42      /storage1/siashared9
    

    and

    Wallet status:
    Encrypted, Unlocked
    Confirmed Balance:   55.39 KS
    Unconfirmed Delta:  +0 H
    Exact:               55393041096818614205240021389 H
    Siafunds:            0 SF
    Siafund Claims:      0 H
    

    My expectations are not met...
    Reported locked collateral has increased but not to what I expected. And "risked collateral" has doubled, but the storage space used by renters has increased only by ~11%.
    And wallet balance has increased not decreased as I expected...
    And the reduced price has resulted more in reduced expected earnings than more increased usage.
    The reason for that could be that my high pricing holds my host off from top200 and that means that existing renters do not even ask for my hosts settings. On my renter node I still see totally outdated data of my host... but in the hostdb.log I find:

    2017/09/16 21:52:14.237643 scan.go:339: Performing scan on 200 online hosts and 200 offline hosts.
    2017/09/17 00:38:43.150031 scan.go:339: Performing scan on 200 online hosts and 200 offline hosts.
    2017/09/17 04:09:12.437431 scan.go:339: Performing scan on 200 online hosts and 200 offline hosts.
    2017/09/17 11:15:30.150692 scan.go:339: Performing scan on 200 online hosts and 200 offline hosts.
    

    I suspect that once you are pushed out of top 200, you never get queried again.
    So I have to continue the price reduction to get into top 200 again. Though, that does not guarantee my host getting queried ever again from existing nodes, as these assume my host has price over 500SC and resulting score puts my host into #260, so out of "worth scanning" list.

    So the next stop will be at 400SC/TB/month, that would be roughly what in my opinion is justified if the coin price on exchanges does not rise substantially. And that would be the point where I should start to reduce the collateral offered.



  • Uh. All my latest assumptions were wrong...
    Still hovering around #250 in ranking score but getting new big contracts and new data uploaded.
    https://siahub.info/host/1687
    Expected earnings are above 5SC/day again. Though, by hosting more data.

    But the problem with estimating/controlling the collateral is not solved.
    2/3 of my allowed collateral are reported to be locked (50KS), but only 1/3 (25KS) have left my wallet.
    So if I continue to get many new contracts I'll run out of collateral...



  • So, nothing interesting happened in the last 3 weeks. Updated to the "release candidate" version 1.3.1.
    But no numbers except contract count have changed as a result.
    Today a big contract expired:

    2017/10/11 07:38:08.832593 storageobligations.go:851: file contract complete, id 57fe2bb4b6bce56ab060e473d9b97b30943548c4fc5409e49b3c9e2b391ec8c0
    2017/10/11 07:40:31.417025 storageobligations.go:558: Successfully submitted a storage proof. Revenue is 173495373688234423181377536.
    

    But the weird errors did not disappear (i hoped for them to end by upgrading to the 1.3.1 version).
    These are less frequent now:
    2017/10/11 09:39:25.598720 storageobligations.go:574: Missed storage proof. Revenue would have been 2500000000000000000000000.
    But the suspicious thing is they have the same 2500000000000000000000000 expected revenue.

    In the last month since I added 2 more terabytes to the shared space and gradually reduced the storage price to 400 the utilization grew slowly and reached again 6%. As the complete contract that ended today was over 100GB, utilization dropped to 5%.
    So, for the history snapshot of the siac host -v:

    Host Internal Settings:
            acceptingcontracts:   Yes
            maxduration:          53 Weeks
            maxdownloadbatchsize: 83.89 MB
            maxrevisebatchsize:   83.89 MB
            netaddress:           sia.eters.lv:9982 (manually specified)
            windowsize:           24 Hours
    
            collateral:       1.5 KS / TB / Month
            collateralbudget: 75 KS
            maxcollateral:    15 KS Per Contract
    
            mincontractprice:          2.5 SC
            mindownloadbandwidthprice: 0 H / TB
            minstorageprice:           400 SC / TB / Month
            minuploadbandwidthprice:   50 SC / TB
    
    Host Financials:
            Contract Count:               125
            Transaction Fee Compensation: 217.5 SC
            Potential Fee Compensation:   657.5 SC
            Transaction Fee Expenses:     0 H
    
            Storage Revenue:           310.4 SC
            Potential Storage Revenue: 1.037 KS
    
            Locked Collateral: 53.93 KS
            Risked Collateral: 3.326 KS
            Lost Collateral:   0 H
    
            Download Revenue:           22.63 mS
            Potential Download Revenue: 0 H
            Upload Revenue:             10.55 SC
            Potential Upload Revenue:   15.42 SC
    
    RPC Stats:
            Error Calls:        150
            Unrecognized Calls: 65
            Download Calls:     7628
            Renew Calls:        98
            Revise Calls:       2988
            Settings Calls:     71578
            FormContract Calls: 29
    
    Storage Folders:
        Used         Capacity      % Used    Path
        14.454 GB    249.913 GB    5.78      /storage1/siashared0
        20.036 GB    249.913 GB    8.02      /storage1/siashared1
        13.468 GB    249.913 GB    5.39      /storage1/siashared10
        13.942 GB    249.913 GB    5.58      /storage1/siashared11
        14.177 GB    249.913 GB    5.67      /storage1/siashared12
        14.294 GB    249.913 GB    5.72      /storage1/siashared13
        14.105 GB    249.913 GB    5.64      /storage1/siashared14
        14.286 GB    249.913 GB    5.72      /storage1/siashared15
        14.022 GB    249.913 GB    5.61      /storage1/siashared16
        11.237 GB    249.913 GB    4.50      /storage1/siashared17
        7.311 GB     249.913 GB    2.93      /storage1/siashared18
        7.613 GB     249.913 GB    3.05      /storage1/siashared19
        19.013 GB    249.913 GB    7.61      /storage1/siashared2
        5.968 GB     249.913 GB    2.39      /storage1/siashared20
        5.985 GB     249.913 GB    2.39      /storage1/siashared21
        6.275 GB     249.913 GB    2.51      /storage1/siashared22
        6.140 GB     249.913 GB    2.46      /storage1/siashared23
        5.964 GB     249.913 GB    2.39      /storage1/siashared24
        6.099 GB     249.913 GB    2.44      /storage1/siashared25
        5.817 GB     249.913 GB    2.33      /storage1/siashared26
        6.103 GB     249.913 GB    2.44      /storage1/siashared27
        16.211 GB    249.913 GB    6.49      /storage1/siashared3
        16.328 GB    249.913 GB    6.53      /storage1/siashared4
        15.473 GB    249.913 GB    6.19      /storage1/siashared5
        16.106 GB    249.913 GB    6.44      /storage1/siashared6
        16.286 GB    249.913 GB    6.52      /storage1/siashared7
        15.720 GB    249.913 GB    6.29      /storage1/siashared8
        14.223 GB    249.913 GB    5.69      /storage1/siashared9
    

    and

    Wallet status:
    Encrypted, Unlocked
    Confirmed Balance:   53.9 KS
    Unconfirmed Delta:  +0 H
    Exact:               53902911347492013571251348200 H
    Siafunds:            0 SF
    Siafund Claims:      0 H
    

    The numbers for collateral still do not sum up.
    And contract completion transactions (earned coins) still do not show up in the wallet transactions list.


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